LiveStream, February 1st, 2013

Great music, this is definitely something I look forward to enjoying as opposed to just shutting it off and switching to spotify right away =p I concur with liking the last piece the most.

In regards to your mentions of tying stuff in, I would especially be interested in sound effects manipulation. It would be really cool if there was this subtle re-processing to sounds made on airless planets like they were being simulated.

I'd assume the music would take cues from the entire game regardless of how many windows and where the player focus is at so having multiple windows wouldn't be an issue.

But, I suppose if they wanted, they could have separate tracks for each open window that takes their cues from whatever the focus is in that window. This seems unnecessarily complicated and probably distracting, IMO.

I would like to have sounds for that, something like a really low frequency static humm when zoomed out of the planet into space, somewhat like those "bullet time" effects in the Matrix, but even lower.
Sorry, english isn't my native language so it's a bit difficult to explain exactly what I mean but hope you get the idea.

Homeworld had a "zoom in zoom out" sound (i.e. a sound playing when switching to the strategic view and back). I didn't find it particularly annoying, and I think it's possible to make something for Planetary Annihilation which won't be that annoying as well.

Just give an option to disable that zoom-sound. Cause I am pretty sure it will annoy me after a while.

so guys, may I ask something double, but this is about music and sounds, so I just ask. Will you be able again to hear every freaking long-shot as in TA (and see) on one planet? I loved that, you truly felt like you had the overview.

Wow! The musics you composed are already epic! Cant wait for more!!!!
Congratulations

I wanna ask.. Will the digital soundtrack feature both versions, orchestral and no orchestra, of the tracks?

Why cant they sink the sounds? This is the sound video!!!!

I like the direction of the music and agree with the designer that the music should consist of mellow pieces and not just dramatic fast paced music (which TA had 3-4 superb fast epic tracks that I still listen to). Especially if games are going to last many hours it's not all going to be action.

Oh man, this was awesome.

I just listened to the pieces, and I'm impressed. Despite the evidence of Howard's proficiency presented in the Supcom 2 and SMNC soundtracks, I was still concerned about how the PA soundtrack would turn out. Fortunately, it looks like my concerns are unwarranted, and the PA soundtrack is heading in the right direction after all. The first 3 pieces did a good job of setting the stage for more sedate, base-building gameplay, without being too slow or boring. (While the TA soundtrack is amazing, some of the base-building music was a bit too slow at times.)
However, I think the last song, Epic Victory, absolutely amazing. I think that of all the music presented, that one is the most reminiscent of the original TA soundtrack, perhaps not in style, but definitely in the grandiose scale of the conflict. While the first 3 pieces were played in more of a minor key, with a darker feel to them, which does a good job of giving us that feeling of war and doom. Don't go too far in that dark, minor direction though, as the lighter, major pieces do a better job of making us feel like heroes in a grand conflict, rather than victims of incoming asteroids.

Anyway, here are the (UNEDITED) notes I took during my 3rd playthrough of the music. Please note that I'm not a musician, or a composer, or even a music critic, so what I wrote is not professional review material. Also, I'm aware that the pieces you played are only in their first iterations. I have a friend who is a composer whose music I've reviewed in its early stages, so I know that it will get a lot better from here, especially with an actual orchestra playing. This is just my stream of consciousness thoughts as I listened. Also, there may seem to be more criticism than compliment in them, but as I already stated, I really like what I'm hearing and I think the soundtrack will probably end up sitting right up there with both TA's and Supcom's soundtracks. (Yes, I really loved Supcom's soundtrack too.)

Imminent Doom: Sounds more like a march (of incoming soldiers?). Parts of it have a very Star Wars feel. Sounds mostly like the intro to a much larger piece. Choir somewhat bland, but probably due to the synth.

Scary Intro: Don't care for the rising . . . tone (whatever instruments they were) in the beginning, feels like a cheesy horror movie trying to set up that startling moment. The mechanical beat that follows is very cool, makes me think of a metallic army approaching. I feel like it cut off right before it could get properly interesting, but it's only a musical segment anyway. Howard is right, sounds very much like a "metallic" piece.

Battle Begins: Opening sounds like more of the same from the previous pieces, but then it switches up into something different, which is nice. Like the flutes. The brass parts sound very TA. Not sure I like the way the discordant parts are implemented, but this can be ironed out to sound less jarring and more integral to the piece. Howard is right about the softer parts though, as they are needed to establish a good range in the music. (Some of the faster songs in TA lacked this contrast just a bit, though it was made up for in the slower songs.) Some of the lead brass sounds a bit boring, but that's due to it being hard to hear the counterpoint of the other instruments in this rendition. (Probably will be a lot more complex sounding in the orchestral version.) The cellos at the end sound good, though I feel maybe the repeat is a bit long on them. (But that's just me, as I'm really not into a lot of repetition.)

Epic Victory: Choir sounds very bland at first (but it's synth, and Howard even says that this will be a lot better), but it improves substatially as soon as the men come in. Great buildup, love the piano bits helping the crescendo. Some of the key changes make me think of Murray Gold's Dr. Who work. Also elements of Stargate in there (which no doubt makes Mavor a happy man). Love the violins in the background, making sure we aren't drowned in brass. Drum march is also great. Choir at the end sounds a lot more harmonic than in other areas of this song and others, which is great. No guys, this is not just for loading screens or main menus! This is for epic battles and giant confrontations!

Uploaded the samples to a youtube video

http://youtu.be/RMmzyRIK9UY

Too lazy to watch, any SMNC info in this stream?

There was, believe it or not!
What kind? Well, perhaps not what you think . . .

What time?

13:44-13:46.

Since Howard mentioned in the stream that he wanted people to tell him about where they wanted hooks for sounds and music to go:

How about making specific buildings modify the way the music plays? Maybe add some more deep brass when a base contains a lot of heavy artillery, adding in some more computerized beeps for a base with heavy radar/intelligence systems, or sounds of industrial machines for large production complexes.

It would give you a feel of the type of base you are working with in the soundtrack. And each player would get a bit of his own style of background music.

EDIT:

Adding it into key units might also work. Tying a certain instrument in with the commander, or a heavy bot so that you can literally hear it closing in on the battle because suddenly one instrument becomes just a bit more noticable.
Or categories of units having assigned instruments, so that you can hear the difference between an army of bots slowly marching forward, or a group of hovers zooming into battle, or a swarm of aircraft flying overhead.

Each of course using the same basic soundtrack, but modified just a bit so that your army will sound uniquely like your army.

I'm not a music expert, but prepare for my lengthy analysis. I am probably going to misuse some language here.

I'm effectively comparing this to the TA soundtrack, some of the only game music I've ever listened to outside the game. To say I enjoy it is a slight understatement.

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I think I have to echo that the music may have been a little too fast. Slow pieces are amazing to fill the voids between combat. They bring a lot of emphasis to the combat pieces when they do occur. I don't mean slow down everything that you made, but at least provide something slower for this specific reason.

I think a lot of what made the TA soundtrack so successful was that there were entire songs dedicated to, well, nothing. It was basically just filler noise. When the music does ramp up though, it gets pretty awesome.

What you had as 'quiet' moments was, imo, not quite enough. Loved the fading out, and very interested in what you will be doing with that, although see below for my comment on song themes/direction.

I think the cellos/base/etc (whatever was making the tempo/march) may have been a bit too 'strong'. May have just been my speakers, but I found them a little overpowering throughout that piece. That may have been the intent, but then I have the issue of conflicting themes. There is a very threatening base section, but a rather majestic melody at times.

With that, I think just cut the threatening sections out, and make another piece out of it. With what's left, I think expanding/continuing would make for something amazing.

The victory song was incredible. Only thing I would change is have the melodies/choir to be more clear. Not louder, but just not competing with the other parts. I think dropping everything off but the choir would help (and even dropping that off too, but not as much).

I think I'd just like to have the songs focus on a single theme. It seems like you're trying to provide several different sides to a song, going from one thing to another. I think that could be done just as well by making multiple different pieces, and then focusing on the transitions.

As much as I love complex orchestral pieces, PA isn't going to be a scripted story (which afaik is what drives most of them). Things can change in a flash, but if the 'combat' part of a song is 2 minutes in, it's probably going to miss the event.

Another important aspect is that the music is an indicator of what is going on in the game. Awareness is vital, especially in a game where you will be dealing with multiple different planets, moons, and asteroids. The UI and event notifications can only be so effective, and I believe the music could be integrated into them to help.

That means instantaneous song changes, and songs who's themes are immediately apparent. From what I heard, it seems like that isn't exactly the direction you've decided to take.

One last thing. Don't make everything loud. Please. I can turn up the volume if I want. It's nice to have quiet pieces to listen to while building things. Some people just play games like this to build bases, and then after 2 hours do something with it. Listening to intense pieces the entire time would be nearly impossible.

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TL;DR
- Too loud
- Needs much slower/softer pieces to contrast combat music
- Quiet parts could be even more to contrast epic loud parts
- Lacked focused themes (important for quickly variable events)
- Good transitions > Multi-theme pieces
- Despite all that, I enjoyed what you had

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EDIT: Regarding the comment above...

If every piece had parts that scaled with what was going on, such as buildings which modified the build music, and units that modified the battle music...

... That would be spectacular.

Huh. I really think those songs have way too much noise. Too much bass, too many instruments, changes in pace and rhythm.

Sound is a huge part of the UI. Just as crisp, clean visuals are essential, a song shouldn't be trying to compete with the UI either. There are audio cues, explosions, and all sorts of interactions that will be happening in the background. I NEED to be aware of what's happening in order to play properly!

Compare the songs to the TotalA sound track:
posting.php?mode=quote&f=61&p=665803

Or the Starcraft sound track:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnbCXkAYTGE

These songs have a slower pace, fewer instruments, and are crisp+clear. They leave a LOT of room for interface sounds, so you can crank up the volume, without having them interfere with the game. They support the ambiance, they are not the defining attraction.

Too much noise? No more noise than some TA

http://youtu.be/_CBTZqO83WQ